Nice work if you can get it…quoting for commercial photoshoots.


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Article Dedication

In honor of

Walter Gropius & Staatliches Bauhaus


On the photo forums the perennial question would always pop up on what to charge and how to estimate commercial photography.

I’m not a commercial photog, but I came across a sample quote for a pharmaceutical portrait job involving 12 photos and thought it would be interesting to share with you.

Here is the quote…

Commercial photoshoot estimate


Commercial photoshoot estimate 2


Commercial photoshoot estimate 3

Here are the shoot specs:

Shoot Concept: Portraits and photojournalistic manufacturing lifestyle images

Licensing: Unlimited use of all images captured in perpetuity

Location: On location at a pharmaceutical manufacturing facility in the Northwest

Shoot Days: One

Photographer: Northwest-based portrait and lifestyle specialist

Agency: A Small Northwest-based agency

Client: A mid-sized pharmaceutical company

Creative/Licensing: One of our Northwest-based photographers reached out looking for help pulling together an estimate for a library shoot for a local mid-sized pharmaceutical manufacturer. The agency had contacted the photographer requesting a quote for a one day shoot on location at one of their client’s manufacturing facilities. The project called for 12 setups: four environmental shots of the facility/labs, seven photojournalistic lifestyle images of employees “at work” and one lit/staged portrait. The client required unlimited usage of the library of images. We see a lot of projects along these lines, but this project was a bit unusual because the 12 setups were relatively specific. They didn’t seem to offer a lot of opportunity for variations (as opposed to more dynamic scenarios that may allow for a greater degree of variety in the space, subjects and available actions/activities). Shot one, in particular, was much more carefully composed and art directed because it would be used in trade ads, while the other 11 shots would only appear in collateral pieces. After speaking with the photographer about the hefty shot list, we wanted to make sure the client was aware that it was doable, but perhaps a bit ambitious, and that the day may require some prioritization if we were unable to move around as freely and quickly as expected.

Library fees can start around $7500 a day and will often include unlimited or perpetual usage of all images captured. It should be noted, however, that “library” does not necessarily mean unrestricted use (although it did in this case), and may be used to refer just to the volume of imagery. Accordingly, it is important to make the initial assumption that the client is willing to limit the use in some way. Often, clients are willing to limit either the duration of use or quantity of images for a library shoot, so it is best to begin the conversation with that assumption in mind to avoid inadvertently “giving away” more than necessary. Unfortunately, this was not one of those instances, and the client did, in fact, require unlimited, perpetual use of all images captured. Interestingly, the ambitious shot list helped to minimize the value of the library because the photographer would have to move so quickly from one shot to the next that the variety captured would be severely limited. Additionally, five of the 12 shots were very specific and didn’t allow for variations of any substance. Factoring the volume of shots, limited production footprint, type of client, intended use (including the very specific trade ad shot) and otherwise straight forward nature of the shoot, I set the rate at $10,000 for this shoot.

Client Provisions: I was sure to note exactly what the client and agency would provide: locations, staff “talent,” staging area(s), wardrobe, props, releases and necessary technical and safety advisors. The advisor was important to highlight since we wanted a client rep to be on set to ensure the facility and staff were up to snuff from a technical and safety standpoint. There’s nothing worse than wrapping up a shot and finding out that the subject was supposed to have been wearing safety goggles, so we were sure to put that responsibility on client’s shoulders.

*Tech/Scout Day: Due to the challenges associated with accessing this particular facility, the client was unable to allow for a tech/scout day. It’s generally a very important part of a production such as this, but unfortunately, our hands were tied.

Assistants & Tech: I estimated for a first assistant and a digital tech for the shoot. All but one shot would be captured using available light, and mobility within the facility was a concern, so the smaller the crew footprint, the better. The photographer wanted to tether a laptop on a tripod, so we didn’t need a full workstation rental from the tech, hence the lower rate.

Equipment: I estimated one day of gear rental from a local rental house including a DSLR system, a backup body, a handful of fast lenses, a small lighting and grip kit and a laptop to tether.

Styling: I included one stylist to manage basic hair, makeup, and wardrobe needs for the staff and talent. The talent would be wearing a branded uniform which the client provided, so we didn’t need to do any wardrobe shopping.

Shoot Processing for Client Review: This covered the photographer’s time for the initial import, edit, color correction and upload of the entire shoot to an FTP for client review and final image selection.

Selects Processed for Reproduction: I included basic select processing as a lump sum based on 150/image in this case. This protects the fee in the event the client ultimately selects more or less than 12 images.

Casting and Talent: Since the portrait concept called for a relatively tight shoulder up shot of the talent, they agency was comfortable with a digital casting and reviewing recent comp cards to make their selection. The casting fee covered the photographer’s time to reach out to a couple of local talent agents to request current head shots and share them with the agency for review and selection. The talent fees, in this case, were quoted by the local talent agency. Though this is a very reasonable fee for the usage, we’re often able to negotiate slightly lower fees. The fact that this was for a pharmaceutical client put a little bit of a premium on the talent cost.

Mileage, Meals, and Miscellaneous: Finally, we estimated for miles, meals for the production at the on-site cafeteria, and a bit extra to cover any unanticipated miscellaneous costs.

Results: The photographer was awarded the project and luckily, both the client and agency were very easy to work with, and the facilities proved to be as manageable as we had hoped, all of which allowed the photographer to crank out the entire shot list in a normal 10-hour day.

Source of quote and shoot details: Wonderful Machine.


Women of  the Beat Generation - Daniel D. Teoli Jr. Archival Collection (3)m

From Girls of the Beat Generation

A forthcoming 6 volume artist’s book series by social documentary photographer Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

A complete list of artist’s books by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


De Wallen Graffiti 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


The pussy generation…the bold street photographer does best.


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Article Dedication

in Honor of

David ‘Chim’ Seymour & Walker Evans


Here is a snip from a Clint Eastwood interview and his take on the Pussy Generation

We live in more of a pussy generation now, where everybody’s become used to saying, “Well, how do we handle it psychologically?” In those days, you just punched the bully back and duked it out. Even if the guy was older and could push you around, at least you were respected for fighting back, and you’d be left alone from then on….I don’t know if I can tell you exactly when the pussy generation started. Maybe when people started asking about the meaning of life.

Weegee also sums things up for the timid street photog wannabee when he said,

” There are sheltered souls, who are afraid to mingle with strangers. Some of them go in for table-top photography…a plain case of mental masturbation. To make (street) pictures, you can’t just be polite. You have to go around sticking your nose in other people’s business, same as a midget in a nudist camp.” (quote condensed)

Generally speaking, the bold street photog does best – not the timid one that is scared of their own shadow.

Here is a short video on Weegee…”You can’t be a nice Nellie and do street / news photography.”

Backup link for audio:

Even if your balls are the size of shriveled up, freezer burnt, green peas there is hope for the timid photog. What they need to do is to perfect their candid skills so they have little or no fear of being caught.

The young guns coming up are too politically correct to shove their cam in people faces. Society also makes it tough for male photogs to shoot kids. An old guy in his 60’s like me is labeled a sexual predator if they are caught shooting kids on the street.

Well…that is if you are caught!

Many photogs are overthinkers, worried at every possible opportunity. By the time they do all their mental masturbation, the shot is long gone. Shoot first…masturbate at home

There are bold mushroom hunters and there are old mushroom hunters…but there are no old, bold mushroom hunters. That was what an old time shroomer told me that when I told him he was not bold enuf in his foraging. We were discussing edible mushrooms and pushing the edibility envelope.

As a street photog ,boldness is an important part of the success equation. But like anything else, too much of good thing can be harmful. As an example – water and air are life sustaining, but in excess they can kill.

Here is my formula for staying safe on the street and still bringing home the goods with a balance of boldness and street smarts.

Don’t fall into these self-defeating traps…

On the Rangefinder Forum, a camera fondler gave up shooting the red rooms of Amsterdam before he even got in town. In his mind he was convinced he would fail. He quit before he started.

Camera fondlers are always blaming their equipment. Over nearly 50 years of shooting I have used many types of cams. I can tell you if the camera is capable of recording the scene and you don’t get the photo…it is not the cameras problem, the problem is with you.

As the timid photog perfects their candid skills, they will be able to work with impunity right up in people’s faces.

NYE Piercing Darkness Infrared Flash 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Infrared flash helps, but invisible flash or not, you still have to stick your cam in people’s faces. Once you master your skills you can work between the 2 mediums seamlessly picking the best technique for the subject.


Selection from Iconoclastic Reporter artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.



The way it has always been…life isn’t easy for the artist.


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Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

I’ve always know how tough it can be for photogs to get ahead. But until I watched Ken Burns series on the history of Jazz I didn’t know they shared all the same issues.

Highly recommended series that showcases the bohemian life and what the artist goes through to practice their art…get it from your library.


De Wallen Graffiti 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

The difference between Graphic Designer, Art Director and Creative Director.


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Good article on the different creative jobs…

You had better be very careful…people are real assholes nowadays.


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De Wallen Postcards copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

‘Postcard Display Amsterdam’

Selection from ‘De Wallen: Amsterdam’s Red Light District’ artist’s book by Daniel . Teoli Jr.

I got 6 virus emails last week all from a recognized email address. Somehow they can use what seems to be a legit address now. Luckily I checked with the person as the mail looked suspicious. If the thieves had sent just 1 email they would have hooked me.

I bought a used $150 laptop that I use for email and web surfing of suspected virus sites. I wont use my main work computer for email any longer, can’t afford to lose it.

I used a YouTube audio converter and it would give you ransomware infection when you would click on the wrong popup. It actually did convert the video into audio, but you got a virus for the service.

…life is very stressful nowadays.


De Wallen Graffiti 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.



Announcing placement of the ‘Encyclopedia of Ink Jet Printing’ with the Metropolitan Museum of Art


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A 12 volume set of the Encyclopedia of Photographic and Fine Art Ink Jet Printing Media has been placed with Metropolitan Museum of Art Department of Photograph Conservation.

The 72 book edition of the Encyclopedia is currently the world largest set of hand-printed contemporary artist’s books ever made. More importantly, it is a very important and unique reference collection for archival research and those interested in ink jet printing.


Final placement of the edition are as follows: 

 Center for Creative Photography Department of Conservation, Arizona – Set # 1/5

 Rijksmuseum Research Library, Netherlands  – Set # 2/5

 Rare Books and Manuscripts Library Ohio State University, Ohio  – Set # 3/5

Image Permanence Institute Rochester Institute of Technology, New York  – Set # 4/5

Metropolitan Museum of Art Department of Photograph Conservation – Set # 5/5

 Amon Carter Museum of American Art Department of Conservation, Texas – Proof Set

Encyclopedia of Ink Jet Printing Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr 1 Encyclopedia of Ink Jet Printing Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr 2


De Wallen Graffiti copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

A good interview with Susan Meiselas….style can’t sustain you.


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Article Dedication

in Honor of

Frank Tartaro & Bob Pace

Two Greats from the Dye Transfer Printing Era.


A good interview with Susan Meiselas…style can’t sustain you.

Backup link:

As far as style can’t sustain you? Projects can sustain you, at least they sustain me.

I’m bored with photography…that was what a film shooting, photo forum member posted a while back. He said he wasn’t shooting much, maybe a roll of film every few months and was losing interest in photography. It is hard for film to compete with digital in our instant world.  I’m an old film photog from the 1960’s and shot film for many, many decades. But I am not into ‘the process’ for jollies…I just want the iconic photo brought in by the best and easiest means possible.

I used to be on the APUG film forum until they threw me out. Seldom did I see AYTHING great ever come out of that forum. The film fondlers were in love with the process, not the result. Since this bored photog does not produce anything worthwhile, he has to put his pride in saying ‘Hey…look at me, I shoot film.’ (The camera fondling digital photogs are not left out of the ego battle even if they don’t shoot film. Their chant…‘Hey…look at me, I shoot manual!)

The bored photogs problem is that he has no reason to shoot. You can only get so much satisfaction in saying ‘I shoot film.’ Especially if your reality is; you seldom do shoot film. It does not matter if you shoot film or digital,  having a great project is very important to the photog. A project gives a photog direction and purpose. A project can showcase the photogs talents. Many great photogs are known for landmark projects they have done. I’d advise any bored photogs to find a project and devote themselves to it.

In my own photo life I seldom shoot anymore unless it IS for a project or to put a shot into a institutional collection or my portfolio. I can’t afford wasting time shooting stuff that will go nowhere, just no time to fool around. Even if I stopped taking photos today I have 3+ years of photos I have not even looked through yet and tons of artist’s books to finish.

A complete list of artist’s books by Daniel D. Teoli Jr…

My photo problem is not boredom, it is the opposite. Too many projects and a lack of time. If I wanted to shoot the garden variety, camera fondler photos, like they have on the photo forums, I could shoot day and night 7 days a week. So, how is there any time to be bored when it comes to photography?


Street photography is like fishing – you can put in the time and still not reel anything in. So, I have a number of projects that I shoot off the cuff to keep me pressing the button through dry spells.

A little known book, Smokers and Sleepers was done something along these lines.

One of my boredom projects is shooting people while yawning candid. It is good practice for fast shooting a yawn does not last very long.

Shot with infrared flash.

PD 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr - C PD Infrared Flash 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr mr - C

Only problem with people yawning is they seem hard to come by.

Kissing is another area that can produce some nice photo ops while on the street.

Piercing Darkness Infrared Flash 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr - C

PD Daniel D. Teoli Jr mr- Co

BMG selection copyright 2014 Daniel d. Teoli Jr. mr

…I’m not that fussy about what they are kissing either…

Bikers Mardi Gras no. 88 copyright 2014 Daniel d. Teoli Jr. mr

37Whoop-Whoop 111 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Kissers Daniel D. Teoli Jr (1) Kissers Daniel D. Teoli Jr mr Kissers Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

People pointing is another good subject for fast shooting.

Dancing Queen Bride Copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

BMG Project Infrared Flash 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr mr - Copy

I have lots of pointing pix, but don’t want to put them in here.  I don’t want to sign my name to them online since they will dilute my portfolio of good work. They are something you would find on your average photo forum and nothing special. I shoot em for fast shooting practice and out of boredom.

NYE Piercing Darkness Infrared Flash 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Further reading:



From Girls of the Beat Generation


De Wallen Graffiti 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


Why Street? It sounds ridiculous!


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Article Dedication

in Honor and Memory of

Anthony William ‘Tony’ Jones aka Tony ‘Indiana’ Jones

Tony was an early travel mentor of mine. As a young kid starting out, he generously breast-fed me a diet of comisionistas and barequeros on the Avenida Jimenez


Since I have a lifetime ban from the Rangefinder Forum I will discuss the Why Street? topic here. My comments are in green.

From the Rangefinder Forum… 

Devin Bro
B-9's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,453

Why? Street

You know what frustrates me?

“It’s not good for shooting street”

“I only shoot street”

“Street photography”

“It will be great for those who do street”

It sounds rediculous!

Hello, My name is Devin, I’m a street carpenter, I only work with wood on the street, my Estwing 16oz hammer is ideal for street carpentry, but my sledge is just to bulky and people really notice how large it is when I’m hammering wood in the street.

I love my cameras (tools) and taking photos is the product of my love. I couldnt care less about anyone’s opinion of my photos. I am not a photographer! I am an Artist with many tools.

This is a fad I see on EVERY video about a new camera. It’s apparently a new criteria for manufacturers.
Why is this such a fad these days? “Street”

The ‘street photography’ designation is not ridiculous. If you were a dedicated street photog you would realize this B-9. It is very small minded of you to think that all photography is the same and uses the same tools. You should know that a rough carpenter is not the same as a finish carpenter or a chair maker. They each have their own skill set and tools.

Zig Ziglar, the wise man from Yazoo City, Mississippi used to ask…”Do you want to be a wandering generality or a meaningful specific?”

Unless we know what our specialty is, how can we become meaningful in our work B-9?


Sad Buskers Times Square

Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. (Candid infrared flash photograph)

Street photography is popular because it can be participated in right out of our front door. Photogs need something to shoot and street is one of the easiest genre to get into. Street photography is also time honored, empowering and very rewarding to do.

But I take it from your post you are not taking issue with people taking photos on the street, you are just upset with the concept of using street photography as a marketing concept and possibly as a legitimate field of photography.

From the very beginnings of photography, photographers have been fascinated with the candid photo.

Click on image for hi res version

Nowadays, the camera companies need an ever growing customer base to keep buying cameras, so they market to a hopefully growing segment of camera consumers…the street photographer. But, street photography is just one of the many dozens of categories that photography specialties can be categorized in.

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. (Candid)

Just because one can produce well in one genre, it does not mean they can produce as well in all areas.  Just like medical specialties, cooking specialties, construction specialties, we have specialties in photography.

Pages in category “Photography by genre” Wikipedia


(Looks like they are missing Infrared Photography and Infrared Flash Photography in the Wiki list.) 

Registered User
Arbitrarium's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 87

Just another buzzword to draw in the easily-influenced and those desperate to be part of a clique.

But as a genre of photography it’s as good a word as any for urban, people-focused photography.

However, yeah… describing one camera as being better or worse for street (sorry) photography is a load of garbage.


Not true.  Some cameras are more conducive to candid street work. But, what other than misinformation can we expect from someone like this?

Take a look at Arbitrarium’s street work:

This is why I harp on the smug camera fondlers. They think they know everything under the sun when it comes to all aspects of photography and the reality is; they don’t know their ass from the proverbial hole in the ground.

The fondlers dispense the wrong information and the young gun photogs coming up lap it up as gospel. No wonder we have such shitty street photography on the photo forums.

Lost Princess Copyright 2013 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

The Lost Princess (Candid)

Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

In Weegee’s day the photog didn’t have to worry about being labelled a sexual predator when he shot stranger kids on the street. In 2017 things are very different. Weegee said there was no such thing as a ‘candid camera,’ there are just candid photographers. I would respectively have to disagree at least half-way with Weegee and say every camera is not the same when it comes to their ability to be good as candid street cams.

But Weegee came from an age where he did it all with a 4 x 5 press camera, so he was used to making due with a 9 pound monster. The flip side of the coin is as Weegee said. Even if you give a small camera to a incompetent street photog they wont be able to do any good with candids.

1936 Temple of Dreams Daniel D. Teoli Jr. Archival Collection m

Daniel D. Teoli Jr. Archival Collection


You never know when your fast, street shooting skills will come in handy. I was driving to the airport and drove past a homeless tent encampment in L.A. No place to stop, already late for my flight…I shot it through my car’s windshield while driving.

In the Shadow of City Hall

From The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

…and the fast street skills you develop on asphalt are readily transferable when you go indoors on carpet…

Happy Hour

Selection from On the Fly artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

I’ve been a street / doc photog for 48 years. My photographs are in over 130 museums and curated collections around the world.

Partial Listing:

I’ve got nothing to sell you, no agenda to push, so I am not going to feed you a lot of bullshit. I’m not trying to get you to buy my book or come to my seminar. I’m not pretending to be a ‘rumor mill’ that is secretly funded by the camera companies. You don’t have to PayPal me $5 to support my ever growing family. I am just telling you the truth, as I can best discern it to be, according to my experience as a street photographer.

Yes, you can do street work with most any cam, but if your goal is candid photography, some systems are just not best suited for it. It is like forcing a cook to use a machete to peel potatoes instead of a paring knife. They are both knives, yes you could use it if you must, but they are not really fungible.


Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


No Arbitrarium, street photography is not always a clique, for many of us it is our life. Yes, they have meet-ups with hoards of camera fondlers roving the street for photo ops, but these are usually not serious street photogs.

Bikers Mardi Gras #14 Copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Selection from Biker’s Mardi Gras artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

The gift that photography provides me is a way to make sense of my world. I don’t do photography to make money or to try and ‘change the world’ for the better. I am not a god, I don’t claim to know what is better. But, I can freeze time to get a better look of it at home.

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

You see,  if freezing time is in your blood, being a do-gooder or making $ does not matter.  If your dedicated to your art, you must produce and keep producing, whether you have an outlet or not to make $…or even have any practical use for your output.


Faces of Gentrification

Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Art is the way many of us make sense of our world. A wordsmith sifts it all through their brain and writes a book or article, a musician composes a song, a poet pens a poem, an artist sketches a drawing or does a painting, a photog shoots a pix, a sculptor forms a statue, a choreographer creates a dance. We each express what is in us and make sense of our world through our art.

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Georges Simenon summed up how it is for the writer and this can go for any of the arts as well.

“Writing is considered a profession, and I don’t think it is a profession. I think that everyone who does not need to be a writer, who thinks he can do something else, ought to do something else. Writing is not a profession but a vocation of unhappiness. I don’t think an artist can ever be happy.”

Irrespective of recognition, fame and riches, dedicated photogs all have one thing in common…we know photography is our life blood and as long as we can keep pressing the button and freeze time, we feel the better for it.

Weegee on the subject…

“Sure. I’d like to live regular. Go home to a good looking wife, a hot dinner, and a husky kid. But I guess I got film in my blood.”


Registered User
css9450's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Chicago
Posts: 642

Originally Posted by B-9 View Post
I like Urban over Street to categorize photos.

Urban works for me. I don’t do “people” photos but I shoot a lot in blighted parts of the big city. I don’t call what I do “street”.

Nikon S2, S3, F, F2, FM2, FA, N90S, D80, D7000, D750, Sony a6000, Canon IIf, Leica CL, Tower type 3, Zorki 4, Vito B, Perkeo II, Rollei 35….

css9450 is offline

Fair enough.  You call your work urban – I will call my work street.

Street work is mainly about candid photography of people on the street. If you ask for permission and pose the subject then it is termed as street portraits. But, just because you are good at street portraits it does not mean you are good at candid street work and vice versa.

Cornered Copyright 1973 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. 

Within this genre we can always mix in a few photos that do not have live people in them. But if someone wants a book on street photography they usually are not looking for a book full of statues and sunsets, which both are also on the street.


Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 24

I think documentary could be a good way to describe street photos. I see a lot of images labeled street that really don’t have a punchline but do a good job documenting the scene.

NeonKnight is offline

Sure, street is a form of social documentary photography, but a dedicated book on street photography should not be all about interior documentary photography. We can mix in a few with our street work, but don’t overdo it.

New Year’s Eve…Skid Row Bar

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. (Candid)

Here is the Hierarchy of Documentary Photography which I developed:

1. Candid events unfolding as they happen.

2. If it cannot be perfected or obtained as a candid, then the photo must be posed.

3. If it cannot be perfected or obtained as a posed photo, then it must be staged with the proviso it is a recreation of past events, preferably with the actual persons reenacting the events.

4. Figments of the imagination. Varies in documentary value.  Can be based on pure speculation or a recount of events.



1967 photo of Diane Arbus taken by Fred McDarrah

Just because you have documentary talents it does not mean you have great candid street talents. Diane Arbus was a good example of this. She was good at befriending oddball people and taking street portraits, but she was not known for candid street work. Her gear picks were also not the best for candid street shooting.

Arbus was not the only woman ‘street photog’ that bulked up on gear…

Mary Ellen Mark with street camera setup

2010 Internet photo of Mary Ellen Mark

If the photog specializes in street portraits then almost any cam will do. The photog can take their time to get the shot. The criteria is; if the camera can record the scene then it will work. 

26Whoop-Whoop 123 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr (9)

Selection from 180: The Circular Fisheye at Large artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

The problem with some of the so-called street cams is they do not have fast enough auto focus or you can’t adjust the controls fast enough to get the shot. As a street photog, we don’t have the luxury of retaking missed shots. 


Registered User
PunkFunkDunk's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 27

So much of street photography seems to me to confuse subject for content, including so-called “masters” like Meyerowitz. Artistically, he has nothing to say. Where Evans’ great achievement was apprehending the distinctiveness of the American vernacular, both its zenith and swift decline, in the built environment — which is to say, figuring the uniqueness of the confluence of a ‘new world’ frontier character, the verve of black culture as it evolved in America and, later, the ascendency of consumer capitalism upon daily lives — well, Meyerowitz and his attendant fan boys then and now give us meaningless compositions of serendipitous emptiness, “moments”, neither decisive nor determined, to reveal more than that which we can see. Which is fine, I suppose. After all, real artists are rare. For the rest of us, the street is where we belong. And as Seinfeld noted, “not that there’s anything wrong with that!”

The thing the art community likes about the Meyerowitz’s, Eggleston’s and Winogrand’s of the world is their work does not offend anyone. It can be shown anywhere. Meyerowitz is also a very good public speaker, so he is in demand for speaking events.

Hakenkreuz in a Dress copyright 1973 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Hakenkreuz in a Dress   (Not staged – an American Nazi in her bedroom)

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. 

There is a reason I list myself as an ‘underground’ social doc photog. My work is unacceptable for public viewing, shows and exhibitions. I am snubbed at every turn due to prejudice, censorship and societal conventions. Be that as it may, I don’t do social documentary photography for other’s approval.  So, whether snubbed or loved, I only have to please myself with my work.

BMG Project Infrared Flash 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr mr - Copy


Selection from Piercing Darkness artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. (Candid infrared flash photograph)


From the DP Forum…. (They banned me after a few days.)

“Welcome to the Documentary and Street photography Forum, the place to discuss techniques and share galleries and tips related to documentary and street photography.” 

Techniques and tips related to documentary and street photography sums up why a photog needs to label and be clear about their niche they are specializing in. Street photography, museum quality street photography that is, requires special techniques and skills.

Selection from Piercing Darkness artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. (Candid infrared flash photograph)

Just because I am shooting infrared flash at night it does not mean I am invisible. I still have to have outstanding candid skills to get the photo. Since infrared flash does not work at great distances, using it means I have to work very close to my subjects. 

A lot of the so-called street work produced nowadays is done by camera fondlers.

The camera fondlers can’t produce anything worthwhile since they have never put in the time to develop advanced street skills. Through ignorance they tend to dismiss other’s work, concepts and techniques as we have seen in B-9’s post.

I spent 4 years+ just on developing my infrared flash techniques and street skills. Yes, they are 2 distinct skill sets. One set is for the technical aspects of infrared flash photography, the other set deals with candid techniques for using infrared flash. 

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

With regards to gear…almost any of the modern day auto focus cams will beat a rangefinder or manual focus SLR for speed of focus. But, few of the modern day cams will beat a manual cam for on the fly, instantaneously, with no shutter lag shooting in bad light.

21Whoop-Whoop 21 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Selection from Whoop-Whoop artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

It is not that I am stuck on old SLR manual focus lenses and rangefinder designs for retro snob appeal, but these 2 components are what is required to ‘get the shot’ in many of the situations I find myself in. Couple the manual ability with a compact footprint…and you have a great street cam

In the old days, all our cams were manual design. We never thought anything about it. So the camera companies didn’t go out of their way with promoting cameras as street friendly. You had small cameras, medium cameras and big cameras. But they were all manual cameras and the only choice you had was to decide on size.

12Whoop-Whoop 38 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Selection from Whoop-Whoop artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

If you have the money, Leica has perfected what is needed in a documentary camera eons ago. Impeccable manual controls, simplicity, reliability and a small footprint.  The compact Leica especially excels at low-light, manual focus and / or zone focus work.

The other benefit of the Leica is straightforward manual controls like shutter speeds and aperture. You can adjust the controls without even looking at the camera, you can just count the clicks.

This is not revolutionary stuff…focus, aperture and shutter speed and the rule of 16 was how it had always been back in the day…until the camera fondling engineers complicated the equipment.

The worst invention they ever made was the shutter program dial. The menu driven cameras are so complex nowadays, I would love to shoot the M43’s if they were Leica-like, but I can hardly figure out how to adjust them.

26 De Wallen Artists' Book Copyright Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr.

Selection from De Wallen: Amsterdam’s Red Light District artist’s book

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr. (Candid)

Another nice thing about the Leica is you can zone focus a Leica by not looking at it. You feel the protrusion on the lens and adjust it to a predetermined spot correlating to the focus scale. 

For those on a budget, a used Fuji-X does offers some of the same benefits as the Leica with limited manual controls. But in low light, the Fuji has terrible low light autofocus and most of their lenses are dumbed down when it comes to manual controls.

Selection from Peephole: Peering Into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A. artist’s book by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

If you are not shooting in tough lighting conditions or fast, on the fly shooting, then most any modern day digital cam will produce to one degree or another. Some may be better than others with ‘this or that’ feature, but it usually boils down to the photog, more so than the cam.

Alan Watts used to say we define ourselves by our enemies. He used the beatniks and squares as examples. That is what the opening post by B-9 smacks of. I find this attitude all over the photo landscape…if I can’t compete, then my ego demands I must condemn.


Now, besides cameras, there is another aspect of doing museum quality street work we have not discussed. That aspect is the attitude and personality of the street photog.

Weegee gives us the bottom line

Backup audio link:

There is a high chance the hardcore street photog is going to have a different attitude, personality and ego than an anal landscaper or star trail photog. The street photog may not be as anal as the tripod photog when it comes to technical aspects, but their nature shows a different anal aspect when it comes to their personality.


Grand Central Station NYC (Candid)

The street photog may have to work outside of normally accepted societal conventions if they want to get the shot. As such, that special ‘anal aspect’ the street photog must posses can be summed up in the vernacular thusly…success on the street sometimes involves being an asshole.

The photog usually does not set out to be an asshole, but when you concentrate only on ‘getting the shot’ it is a natural offshoot of the process. And this need to be an asshole only comes about if you insist on in-your-face, candid photography like I do. On the positive side, the better you are at candid work, the less asshole-ish you need to be.


Holy Water Bowl St. Patrick’s Cathedral NYC (Candid)

If you’re OK with doing the garden variety street photography you see on photo forums, the asshole issue should not be a problem for anyone. Just shoot from the hip far away or get a long telephoto lens, stand across the street and blast away.

But the majority of this type of photo forum street work I see smacks of…’Hey look at me, I just shot a mishmash of strangers on the street that don’t mean anything to anyone.’ These photos usually only hold interest to the photog that took them and possibly the people in the photo.

Order Women Like Pizza Daniel D. Teoli Jr. v29 mrOrder Women Like Pizza Copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Order Women Like Pizza – Las Vegas (Candid)

The confused, mishmash of strangers on the street is what I try to avoid…and I avoid it by getting personal with my subjects. And getting personal with strangers is where the need to be an asshole comes in.

De Wallen Postcards copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Selection from De Wallen: Amsterdam’s Red Light District artist’s book
by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

You will have to decide if what I have laid out here is right for you. What I have told you is how I do it, but it is by no means the only way to do street photography.

When I was a young photog growing up in L.A. I wanted to be a fashion / studio photog. One day it sunk in I had no talent for those areas. I decided to move on to street and social doc photography and never looked back. That was a day of enlightenment for me. If you are dissatisfied with your photography you will need your own day of enlightenment to see where your talent lies.

Good luck in finding it!


The Flappers -Daniel D. Teoli Jr. Archival Collection (1)m

Selection from The Flappers

a 6 volume artist’s book series

by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

A complete listing of artist’s books by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


De Wallen Graffiti 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Announcing placement of the Encyclopedia of Ink Jet Printing with Rochester Institute of Technology Image Permanence Institute.


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A 12 volume set of the Encyclopedia of Photographic and Fine Art Ink Jet Printing Media has been placed with Rochester Institute of Technology Image Permanence Institute.

Previous sets of the Encyclopedia have been placed at The Center for Creative Photography Department of Conservation, The Rijksmuseum Research Library in the Netherlands, The Rare Books and Manuscripts Library Ohio State University and The Amon Carter Museum of American Art Department of Conservation.

Encyclopedia of Ink Jet Printing Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr 1 Encyclopedia of Ink Jet Printing Daniel D. Teoli Jr.  mr 2

The 12 volume Encyclopedia is currently the world largest set of hand-printed contemporary artists’ books ever made. More importantly, it is a very important and unique reference collection for archival research and those interested in ink jet printing.


De Wallen Graffiti copyright 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

Whether you call it camera fetishism or camera fondling…it is all the same disease.


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 Article Dedication

In honor of

Robert “Radio Bikini” Stone & Donna Ferrato


Over at the Rangefinder Forum they were discussing camera fetishism. Whether you call it camera fetishism or camera fondling…it is all the same.

Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 13

Is the Leica obsession a fetish?

HNY everyone

Over the course of 2015 I acquired a couple of Leica lenses and an M3, all of which I use and enjoy. Yet since obtaining these tools, I’ve also developed a strange obsession with other lenses, bodies, etc. The 28mm summicron ASPH, the noctilux, the M-240, etc. Although an objectively low-earning type, I could probably afford buy an M6 and a 35mm lens, or whatever, which I would also use and enjoy. But my real question is whether or not the fixation on Leica merch and glass, tools if you will, is a fetish.

Does anybody else spend large amounts of time looking at pictures of cameras and lenses that they’ll probably never buy, even if they could? Is it a fetish? When I was a mechanic, I remember snap-on tools had a huge pull, but for whatever reason, maybe the marketing/ad dept, they never captivated my desire and imagination to such a profound level.

While I must say these tools have fostered a newfound interest (and ability to pursue) in composition, the darkroom, B+W photography, and I have educated myself the best I know how, something about the desire for more gear and the fascination with expensive glass feels oddly perverse. Sometimes you’re up at four AM and reading Overgaard or looking at the classifieds here and it just feels a little off.

The Rangefinder Forum gave me a lifetime ban a few years ago, but I still like to check in to see what the camera fondlers are up to even if I can’t post. Really, it is the best of both worlds for me. I can read the forum and comment exactly like I want to without censorship here. And I don’t have to listen to the head camera fondler that runs that forum.

Camera Fondler copyright 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Well, I may have been the first to coin the term ‘camera fondler,’ but it is NO joke. I find the vast majority of the photogs on the photo forums are not serious photogs and fall into the camera fondler category. They spend more time fingering their cams and getting hard-ons than pressing the button.

We can see this in poor mgrinnan’s post. He wants to be a great photog, but the best he can do is read the want ads and fantasize about what to buy next. In short, instead of looking for opportunity to press the button more, he is looking at camera porn and drooling to acquire more equipment.

A common trait with the fondlers is this…they feel they can never produce anything worthwhile with what they got. They always blame their equipment and never themselves for their shortcomings. They believe if they only had ‘this cam or that lens’ – then they could produce!

Here is the deal…

If you don’t produce anything worthwhile photographically, then just admit to yourself your a collector / fondler. There is nothing wrong with being a fondler. The damage comes when the fondlers make themselves out to be experts at photography and dispenses the wrong information to the young guns coming up. That is the issue I have with the fondlers.

Here is an example…

One fondler on the photo forums said “why doesn’t Leica get rid of the rangefinder and shutter speed dial and put auto focus and a program dial on the M.”

Fondlers…do you ever wonder why your photos look like they do? Believe me fondlers, auto focus and a program dial has nothing to do with how my photos come out.

21Whoop-Whoop 21 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

I was first exposed to the fondling notion after I inherited a few thousand dollars of silver when my mom died. I joined a precious metals forum and asked about disposing of it. After reading the posts there I discovered the precious metals devotees like to take their gold and silver and fondle it.

I was looking for a good tactical flashlight and joined a flashlight forum…same thing. Many members amass flashlights not to use them, but to fondle them.

You would never think so, but flashlight fondlers can spend tens of thousands of $ on their lights.

The SureFire HF4B Hellfire (circled in red) cost $4989.99 just for it!

Some flashlights that didn’t cost very much when issued now go for thousands of $… like this Surefire U2 Porcupine

Custom made flashlights can cost $1500 to $3000+ each…

Guns…same thing… lots of gun fondlers….they love to play with their guns, but never get round to shooting them all.

Flashlight and gun photos are from the internet.

Well, I must confess that every year or so,  I pull out my Hassy SWC to look it over and ‘dry fire’ it a few times. I give it a few minutes of fondling and reminiscing. I think back to the old days when the SWC was my mainstay.

Crazy Copyright 1975 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr 'Sunlit Slipper' Copyright 1973 Daniel D. Teoli Jr V16. 56 img525-Print V8 MR 50 img028-view V19 Print Final MR 36 img183-V8 MR 24 'Gypsy Woman' Copyright 1973 MR

But, I can’t develop too much of a hard-on for fondling the Hassy. I got 3 years of photos I have not even looked through yet. That is the curse of digital…makes it easy to produce prolifically.  So, I have to decide whether to be a serious photog or be a serious camera fondler.

…No, I don’t believe in marinating photos a la’ Eric Kim style. I’m just too overloaded with photo projects to have the time.

Well, there are worse things in life than being a camera fondler. There is nothing embarrassing about coming clean.

I mean…you could be into collecting soiled women’s panties for a hobby.

Araki – Tokyo Lucky Hole

Backup link:

Here is the confession of another camera fondler…from the Rangefinder Forum

Fuji fan
lxmike's Avatar
lxmike is offline
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Co Durham NE England
Posts: 1,854

What is your most tactile camera

Rather embarrassingly l have owned far too many cameras and have chopped and changed far to many times however part of the fun is that l have come across a few great beasts that have been great to just sit with and hold. Another member on a different thread highlighted that sometimes a camera just by being there creates a need to fondle it, to hold it…l get this l really do, sometimes l use the excuse that l am just exercising the shutter speeds but deep down l know that l really just need to hold a certain camera, why because certain cameras just need to be held…and so what camera do you just hold, or what cameras have you used that were so special just holding them made you feel good…….just realised that maybe on rereading this thread l need to get out more or get therapy for me to hold a Barnack is a joy, holding and playing with my IIIf gives me great pleasure

Fuji X Pro 1, XE-1, X100, 35/1.4, 18/2
Leitz IIIf BD, Elmar 3.5/3.5, Summar 5/2
Zorki 6, J12 35/2.8
Kodak Retina 1a


He really developed a hard-on for his Leica…didn’t he. Well, at least this guy is honest. That is more than can be said for most of the fondlers out there. If the fondlers could realize one message from this post it is this. There is tremendous enjoyment when you can become settled and satisfied with your gear and are free to just produce iconic work.

A mistake I see many of the young gun, camera fondling photogs make is using big, bulky straps and half cases for their cams. They like to pimp their cams with loads of unneeded crap that weighs them down and makes their cam harder to use.

This camera fondler from the Fuji Forum (they banned me) spends more time changing shutter buttons than actually pressing them….

Cartier-Bresson on what is needed for doc work…

The camera fondlers are on an endless search for the perfect cam that somehow is just beyond their reach and is the ONLY reason why they can’t produce anything worthwhile.

All the while the fondlers load their cameras up with fancy push buttons, thumbs up, custom skins, hand made straps, leather half cases, fat grips, screen protectors and ever other goddamn thing they can think of to put on a cam to bloat their ego and make their cam more useless.

I see some camera shoulder bags selling for $750. An expensive bag will boost the fondlers ego when their photos won’t do the job. I don’t give a shit what cams I use or the bag I carry them in…as long as they do the best job they can for me freezing time.

Of course, when I bring this subject up on the photo forums…they ban me. I’ve been thrown out of a number of forums just for using the words camera fondler. People do not like their bubble burst.

Gamblers Anonymous on the subject of what may drive the fondlers compulsion…


“A lot of time is spent creating images of the great and wonderful things they are going to do as soon as they make the big win. They often see themselves as quite philanthropic and charming people. They may dream of providing families and friends with new cars, mink coats, and other luxuries. Compulsive gamblers picture themselves leading a pleasant gracious life, made possible by the huge sums of money they will accrue from their ‘system’. Servants, penthouses, nice clothes, charming friends, yachts, and world tours are a few of the wonderful things that are just around the corner after a big win is finally made.

Pathetically, however, there never seems to be a big enough winning to make even the smallest dream come true. When compulsive gamblers succeed, they gamble to dream still greater dreams. When failing, they gamble in reckless desperation and the depths of their misery are fathomless as their dream world comes crashing down. Sadly, they will struggle back, dream more dreams, and of course suffer more misery. No one can convince them that their great schemes will not someday come true. They believe they will, for without this dream world, life for them would not be tolerable.”


Jenny copyright 1972 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

OK, the camera fondler may not be a compulsive gambler, but they surely fit into the compulsive spending category. Many addictions share this same dream world addiction. They need their drug of choice to use as an escape from the reality of life.

If you read the camera fondler’s threads on the photo forums they are always about ‘What did you buy?’ and ‘What are you planning to buy?‘ Why don’t they write about, ‘What did you shoot?’ and  ‘What are you planning to shoot?’

The only good thing about the fondlers is they keep the cam companies in biz with their continual spending. More than a few guys on the Leica forum wanted to spend $20,000 for a Leica with no screen when it was first introduced. They felt the screen was the root of their problems. The ‘screen’ was the only reason why they took shitty pix….SAD.

Camera Fondler 2 copyright 2015 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

Well enough ‘Sontag theory’, lets get back to earth with practical application…

Personally, I use a shoulder strap less than 5% of the time. The only reason I would use a shoulder strap is when I need to carry and use 2 cams.

This is how I roll most of the time…

The camera fondlers want the most ego boosting strap they can get. They gravitate towards expensive, bulky, wide, handmade, custom leather and sometimes very bright straps.

I prefer minimal bulk with my wrist straps. The camera fondler would never go for one of the little straps I use. No ego boost nor would they trust their cam with it…the strap could break!

I put the little straps I use to the test. They have a 30 pound bursting strength and will hold 25 pounds with no problem.

Joel Meyerowitz recounts a story of Cartier-Bresson throwing his Leica in the face of a drunk to stun him while retrieving the cam with the shoulder strap. I can’t say the little wrist strap will take that abuse and not break. But barring that use, they have never let me down and I have owned many dozen of them.

Listen up camera fondlers, anal pixel peepers and fanboys…

All things being equal, it is the photog and not the cam that brings in the iconic shot. If you wish to improve your photos do more button pushing and less gear fondling.

BMG 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr. mr

When it comes to having soemthing to fondle…get a boyfriend or girlfriend to fondle and use your gear for what it was intended for…freezing time.

Further reading:


Photographs used herewith are taken from the following limited edition artists’ books by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


Encyclopedia of Photographic & Fine Art Ink Jet-
Printing Media – 12 Volume Set

Peephole: Peering into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A.

Portfolio: Peering into the World of 1970’s Hollywood and L.A.

Bikers’ Mardi Gras

180: The circular fisheye at large!

Gender Benders from the 1970’s


Selection from The Americans…60 years after Frank

a limited edition artist’s book by

Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

A complete listing of artist’s books by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.


De Wallen Graffiti 2014 Daniel D. Teoli Jr.